Rank Insignia for a Communist USA?

[general_tiu]

Does anyone have an idea what would rank insignia for a Communist USA would look like? Both home-brewed and Soviet-installed Commie USA versions are acceptable.

[jrichardn2]

Great question!

I note that the DDR had German, not Russian, style rank badges, so an installed regime would quite likely keep the traditional U.S. rank badges - there's nothing particularly un-Communist about them, and the Soviets often let their satellites maintain traditional items.

I think a native Communist regime would be likelier to change rank badges, to mark the People's Army as something different than the old imperialist army. Communism often has a hyper-rationalist air about it, so the rank insignia would be "logical". On that basis, they might well borrow Soviet insignia, which are very logical.

Or they might use some combination of stripes and stars like the modern Afghan National Army, so as to be completely "new".

A final thought is that the rank titles might also become "logical" (and like early Soviet position titles), e.g., Brigade Leader instead of Brigadier General.

[Chuck Anderson]

I think that if it was a really radical communist regime, they might at first use no ranks at all, like China (and Albania) did for awhile.

It might then evolve into a rather simple rank insignia design, with a minimum of "gold braid" and other such "fancy" stuff.
(Something of a more "proletarian" theme.)

Chuck

[JMRamos]

That would be great. However I suggest Russian-style shoulder boards but using the US officer rank insignia.

[JMRamos]

And for the naval forces the same boards but with the rank rings for Ensigns to Captains (same as in Poland) and stars for Commodores/RADM (LH) to Fleet Admirals

[Chuck Anderson]

Hi Everyone!

A communist USA might not start out as a single communist nation, as there are still differences between the various regions.
As a result there could be more than one new nation coming into being (rather than a single communist USA coming into existence all at once.)

Regionalism would definitely be a factor as one region and then another and then another became a communist nation unto themselves.
This opens up many opportunities for regional variations in their insignia of rank.

A People's Republic of Texas insignia of rank might contain differences from those of a communist nation made up of the New England states, or of Alaska or Hawaii for example.

There are LOTS of possibilities for this class of Hypothetical Rank Insignia.

Chuck Anderson
UniformInsignia Administrator
cbakiteskites@yahoo.com

[JMRamos]

Thanks for that.

[Dorward]

Well, quite a funny idea)) So, having some time and inspiration, I've decided to imagine how the ranks insignia of the "Communist USA" would look like. And here is the result of my imagination))
[url=http://pic.lg.ua/s/iXzga][img]http://pic.lg.ua/x/15/087634/md_ab7b566c.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://pic.lg.ua/s/yScqx][img]http://pic.lg.ua/x/14/296b96/md_89fc3258.jpg[/img][/url]

My approach was to try to combine the traditional US Army ranks insignia system with some more or less recognizable "Soviet-like" style. As you see, there are several "soviet" elements in these insignia: the green textured main field, red signs, "cubes", "rails" and "triangles" of the RKKA insignia before 1943, two-headed eagle and birch leaves instead of oak.

Thanks God all this is just an imaginary situation))

[JMRamos]

These are for the ground forces, so how about those for the air forces, marines, navy and coast guard?

[Chuck Anderson]

Hi Everyone!

It seems that the best way to picture what the insignia of rank of the armed forces of a Communist USA might look like would be to start from the beginning, and establish what forms the "military heraldry" of a communist USA might develop from.

Discounting at first things like regional differences (which surely must be taken into consideration at some point), we need to consider how this communist regime would have come into power.

(1) It could come either through a violent revolution (which would "sweep-away" everything from the earlier pre-communist society), or...
(2) It could be more gradual, changing to a communist society from within, perhaps by elections from an increasingly radical electorate.

(1)
If it came about through violent revolution where everything in the "old order" would be changed quickly, violently (and seemingly "permanently"), I think that they might start out with a system that would use no ranks at all.
The "armed forces" in this case could be something like a Communist Party People's Militia, with perhaps simple green uniforms with accents of red (to look "sufficiently revolutionary" at a glance.)
Once they violently seized power, first they could be more like a "Political Police" force, whose main job would be to ensure the
"loyalty" and "political reliability" of both party members and the general population. (Perhaps almost like "thought police".)
When at some point, the nation had been sufficiently conquered, the Communist Party People's Militia might form itself into something like the Chinese People's Liberation Army in the Mao days, with uniforms but no real rank insignia.
A large part of their "mission" would be to do something like "enforcing communist ideological compliance" of party members and ordinary citizens, (and perhaps "spreading revolution" outside the nation's borders.)

(2)
If the USA became communist through a more gradual process, I think that then there could be more of a resemblance to U.S. military "heraldry", with perhaps something similar to what we have now, but with a more "red revolutionary" theme.

Just a thought.

If such a communist revolution did take place in the USA, (even though I'm a Veteran), I don't think I'd be wearing any uniform and/or rank insignia at all, as I'd most likely be part of the insurgency trying to overthrow the communists.
(My apologies to any leftists amongst our UniformInsignia Forum members.)

Chuck

[Dorward]

Chuck, I suppose we do not speak about USA of our world - as for me, I would prefer to think about some kind of a "Communist USA" from the parallel Universe, in which Vladimir Lenin, say, being defeated in Russia, escaped to USA and somehow was able to "wash their brains" and bring them to the revolt)).

Concerning ranks insignia even for Militia - as you remember, right after the October Revolution, the Reds had no insignia at all, but then they understood that they have to indicate leaders and commanders somehow, and quite soon they provide their military people with triangles and squares on their sleeves under the elbow. So, I doubt that the American Red Army would resemble the Maoist Liberation Army with no insignia - another mentality. And, as you remember as well, all these triangles, "cubes", "planks" and "diamonds" were replaced with traditional Russian "Tsarist-like" shoulder straps in 1943, but with a "socialist" symbols and designs. Traditions is a strong thing, so I'm sure the Communist USA would finally come back to their traditional ranks insignia as well.

[Pavel Močoch]

Hi all.
USA used red insignia such as lieutenant and captain in the Labor Service and the Civilian Support Organization of US Army Europe http://www.uniforminsignia.org/?option=com_insigniasearch&Itemid=53&result=2445

[JMRamos]

Thanks, Pavel.

[JMRamos]

And Chuck, what do you use to make such works? I'm very much inspired to do the same.

[Chuck Anderson]

And Chuck, what do you use to make such works? I'm very much inspired to do the same.

Hi JMRamos!

If you're speaking of the hypothetical rank insignia that I've posted, I look for copyright free government information, and from there I modify it to fit my subject matter.
From there, it's LOTS and LOTS of trial and error, both in drawing and colouring.
You should see how many things I do that I DON'T want to post on UniformInsignia.

One nice thing about drawing hypothetical insignia is that there's room for "artistic license" in creating new insignia, (though the more plausible, the better!)

I've drawn many charts of hypothetical rank insignia for other nations too, but for the most part I stay focused on the U.S. armed forces (as I was in the USAF.) I also drew a table of ranks for the Israeli Foreign Legion.

If you like, you can also reach me at my regular e-mail address at the end of this message.
Thanks!!!!

Chuck Anderson
UniformInsignia Administrator
cbakiteskites@yahoo.com

[JMRamos]

Thanks!